Anyone with 8in subs?

[orlando]

I have read around the net that 8in subs can sound really good and sharp for heavey metal/hard rock etc. Has anyone tryed two 8in sealed and compaired them to one sealed 10in? I'm trying to find out if it's worth trying,

 

 

Thanks........

[misterp]

I have used an array of 8" drivers in a past vehicle, and I'm not a fan of woofer arrays anymore for several reasons, except in Street Beat vechicles.

 

The only advantage the 8" woofers may have is that they are easier to package into the vehicle. There is a lot more to a driver than just it's cone size. I'll take some liberty and re-phrase your question, if you are asking whether multiple 8" drivers can most accurately reproduce low frequency reinforcement than say a single 10" or 12" (emphasis on most accurately) the answer is definitely not, because you cannot get multiple drivers to have exactly the same waveform/articulation as a single driver. If what you are after is maximum sonic fidelity then what you want is total control of the waveform in the vehicle and that is easier to do with a single premium-quality driver than multiple smaller ones; you want the least amount of speakers in the car possible to get the job done.

 

It's mainly a woofer's inductance not its mass that determines its "attack" and "hangover"; the primary thing that cone weight/size alone determines is the resonant frequency of the driver and how much air it can move, not its overall sonic clarity. The latest woofer designs on the market now have motors in them that can be measured in horsepower (!) and they are plenty strong enough to manhandle a larger/heavier cone.

 

This is my opinion: a single optimized JL W7 12" will totally outplay any four 8" drivers both in SPL and sonic clarity; it'll be just as loud but unlike the array of 8" woofers the W7 will still have it's clarity. The Diamond 12" is a very close second IMO and will also dominate the four 8" array. For 10" drivers the Boston 10" is a totally amazing piece and will similarly outplay any other pair of 8" drivers. I'd rather put my money into a single premium woofer than an array of smaller ones. My two-cents anyway...

 

Mr. P.

[orlando]

Thank you for the indepth info. It's nice to get a solid responce Mr P. How do you feel about the punch p-3?

After I bought it I started hearing people say it has poor sound quality among other thing is that true?

I've been trying to find that perfect bass for over a month and just don't know what else to try. I've built 2 sealed boxes rangeing from .71 witch is the spec for that woofer and one that was at the high end of the woofer at 1 cu ft sealed box.

I've tryed poly fill,no polyfill in both and even added wood to the larger one and shrunck the internal size in increments.

 

I'm starting to wonder if 400 rms watts is just not enough to make a sub sound good in a suburban because of the size? Or would two 10in subs be better for my application at lower volumes to achieve a smooth crisp bass that will fill the truck. Or is it my sub is just junk and I need a better sub and a good 600 watts rms amp to get the bass quality in such a large truck?

 

Thanks for your help.....It's starting to drive me crazy and my wife is a little worried

 

Scott......

 

 

PS- Does addeing wood to shrink the volume inside the box affect sound quality at all,compaired to building the box at that certain spec? In short does multible layers of MDF affect the sound quality of the box compaired to a single 3/4 made box at that same size?

[orlando]

The bass I'm looking for is one that blends into the system,rather then one that over powers the system. Does that make any sence?

[misterp]

Yeah I understand what you are after, true audiophile-quality sound reproduction.

 

Filling a sealed box with wood like you have done will not appreciably affect it's sound unless it is ported and the material is between the rear of the cone and the interior port opening. So you're good there.

 

re amplifiers, one can never have too much amplifier, ever. Critical listening music is VERY dynamic and it is going to be hard to achieve something competition-worthy in a Suburban with what you've got. When you look at the digital information encoded on a CD you will see that there are huge swings in db, and that has to be faithfully reproduced to give a convincing image. Something like Spyro Gyra (contemporary jazz) is mastered with huge instantaneous changes in music volume on the order of 50 to 60 db, meaning that the loudest peaks are 50 to 60 db louder than the rest of the regular music. Assuming that the regular "background" part of the music is being played at a comfortable listening level of 70db if the head unit suddenly signals the amplifier to deliver a musical peak which is 60db louder (like a kickdrum hit) then the amp has to deliver several thousand watts (yes really) to avoid clipping, fortunately only for a millisecond but you get the idea. This massive wattage peak doesn't sound offensively loud because it is there and gone in a flash. This is why all SQ-prepped vehicles have massive amplification, because of the dynamic range of the source material (CD) and the risk of clipping.

 

re enclosure sizing - few manufacturers give suggested cabinet specs that are musically worth a darn; what they give to the public are suggested plans to build an enclosure that is safe for the driver, ie a box that can be played loud and abused without the woofer eating itself. So you were doing good to be using trial and error.

 

re box material - doubling-up the mdf is usually not needed with the type of audio system you are building, no I don't think that it will make any difference to have 1.5"-thick walls vs. a well-designed and built box.

 

My opinion, I would start with a premium single 12" woofer (2-ohm) and 1500W and go from there. Woofers, think of stuff like JL W7, RE XXX, Diamond 12". If you are looking for a woofer with a little 'drier' sound then you might like the DD 9000's. Alll these units benefit from lots of box sizing suggestions if you know what forums to look in, or call the manufacturer and they'll give you the winning formula for a competition ready enclosure. My personal opinion I am unimpressed with the Alpine, Sony, Orion, Rockford, etc. Amps, call me old skool but I love the older Orion amps, I bought a used Orion 2500D for $425 off eBay (this is a 3500W amp!); they were built right, lots were made, and they are all over eBay now. Another thing you will have to consider is a second alternator.

 

Sorry to be long-winded -

Mr. P.

 

another thing - don't forget the rest of your system; perfect woofers without proper support from mids and tweets will sound muddy through no fault of their own.

Edited December 7, 2006 by misterp (see edit history)

[TTUtim]

Can't quite go into as much detail as Mr. P, however I've got a JLW3 8"in a ported box under half of the bench seat. It compliments the rest of the system doesn't over power the Bose by any means. One thing to always consider is what type of music do you listen to most of the time? Let that be the guide to your decision. I also put a gain control inside of the armrest so I could adjust the sub depending on the music I'm listening to. Just my .2.

 

Tim

[fast4popper]

I am not going to bang on MrP, but I will say my 4 8 inch mtx 5500's will hit a 137Db and sound awesome and blend extremely well with the rest of my system. as for the JLW7... listen and you decide. its your money and your ears. you know how you like your music. I did my subs this way cause I wanted to prove that smaller subs could sound good and SLAM when built right and tuner properly.

 

MrP, you build your optimized Jl enclosure for your sub and I will bring my 4 8's optimized, and we will let an unbiased person be the judge. its about tuning, the car, the sub, the BOX, (yes a properly deadened box will help and this includes 1.5 inch walls), the music, the person listening.

 

But I will say, your answer was very well said and explained!! Nice job!!

[misterp]

I am not going to bang on MrP, but I will say my 4 8 inch mtx 5500's  will hit a 137Db and sound awesome and blend extremely well with the rest of my system. as for the JLW7... listen and you decide. its your money and your ears. you know how you like your music. I did my subs this way cause I wanted to prove that smaller subs could sound good and SLAM when built right and tuner properly.

 

MrP, you build your optimized Jl enclosure for your sub and I will bring my 4 8's optimized, and we will let an unbiased person be the judge.  its about tuning, the car, the sub, the BOX, (yes a properly deadened box will help and this includes 1.5 inch walls), the music, the person listening.   

 

But I will say, your answer was very well said and explained!!  Nice job!!

Just to be clear, was never meant as an attack on you or your work, hope you realize that I have a great deal of respect for what you do. Only sharing my experience that I've personally had better success using the strategy of larger but fewer woofers combined with adequate amplification. And I totally 110% agree with you that the install details will make or break a system.

 

Mr. P.

[drako]

The most recent JL truck had 4 jl 8 w7. However more important then size is proper box size. A w7 will sound like poop unless its properly powered (with a quality amp ) and in a box built to spec

[orlando]

What do you guys think of these speakers that I'm getting ready to buy in a few days?

jl....XR650-CSi componets for the front doors

jl.......XR525-CXi for the back doors

 

Both together are just over 350 bones at sonix electronix.

 

Getting good compoinets for the front with good mids and smooth tweeters is what I'm looking for. I have never heared these so please voice your oppionion. Please tell me if there is better set in that price range.

 

My 4channel is perrty weak at 40rms per channel so keep that in mind.

 

Is dyno matting the doors worth doing for better mids and bass?

 

This is great thanks for the help....Scott

[Holty]

i just recently dynamatted my 4 doors and back wall. i don't care what anybody says, it made a HUGE HUGE HUGE difference in sound quality, especially with my midbass.

[orlando]

Holty ....any tips on the install of the dyno matt? Do you really need the roller? What do you think of the speakers I listed up above?

 

Scott....

[drako]

i just recently dynamatted my 4 doors and back wall.  i don't care what anybody says, it made a HUGE HUGE HUGE difference in sound quality, especially with my midbass.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ill be doing that in 2 weeks! my whole cab! cant wait, i was going to buy the XR's but i read a bit more. its all in your preference and what you like so go check them out yourself. remember that a amp never pumps out everything advertised because there is always loss

[orlando]

Dracko does that mean there not that great? What do you have?

[04CHASE]

Dynamat = weight