wody Posted June 27, 2008 Report Share Posted June 27, 2008 i think we should all talk about our country and its problems, not just let them be! thats too american if we just let the shit keep hitting the fan. F- that the only shit that has hit the fan thus far, is in the white house right now. shit stains all over that oval office. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brobradh77 Posted June 27, 2008 Report Share Posted June 27, 2008 i think we should all talk about our country and its problems, not just let them be! thats too american if we just let the shit keep hitting the fan. F- that Well thats fine but what exactly are you going to do with this info...we all know after the Bush rigged elections that our vote doesnt mean shit in the long term..Gore won the popular Vote but lost the election???? who really decides the president any way? apparantly it isnt us... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSS04 Posted June 27, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 27, 2008 Well thats fine but what exactly are you going to do with this info...we all know after the Bush rigged elections that our vote doesnt mean shit in the long term..Gore won the popular Vote but lost the election???? who really decides the president any way? apparantly it isnt us... i am trying to make people think about these kinds of things. we should all be talking to our family & friends about this. no one i know wants to talk about these kinds of subjects because they think its "un-patriotic". i'd be un-patriotic if we don't talk about them because shit is so out of hand in our country right now. and yes, we have no say in the voteing process. all the politicains are puppets on the shadow cabinets big strings, and its they're way or the highway. in-case you want to know who controls the shadow cabinet or shadow government, its big business that owns this country. then you have to go to the motives of these elite head hunchos and find what they are striving for, and then you start to see whats really going on. research & you shall find. i'm not trying to spread rumors here or anything, but that is whats really going on, weather you like it or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSS04 Posted June 28, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2008 the only shit that has hit the fan thus far, is in the white house right now. shit stains all over that oval office. my point exactly ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fireman31 Posted June 28, 2008 Report Share Posted June 28, 2008 the game is rigged folks, you don't have to be a political expert to see that either. the only shit that has hit the fan thus far, is in the white house right now. shit stains all over that oval office. I have been saying for some time now that it is all a game, and we are the pawns! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NTMD8R_SS Posted June 28, 2008 Report Share Posted June 28, 2008 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSS04 Posted June 28, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2008 I have been saying for some time now that it is all a game, and we are the pawns! no one will believe it unless they want to believe. alot of people tend to put shades over there eyes when this subject comes up because they're afraid of the truth. and people these days tend to be REALLY biased about shit too. unless its right in front of there face, they don't believe it. just because they havn't done the research on it, they think it can't be true. theres some stupied ass people out there these days and it pisses me off. i came to the realization that society has made them like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lefty Posted June 28, 2008 Report Share Posted June 28, 2008 Your right, I know nothing. I have only spent my last four years studying Political Science-American Politics, Diplomacy, and Foreign Relations, Constitutional Law, etc, etc..on my way to earning my bachelors degree magna cum lade with departmental distinction...but I guess I should just keep my mouth shut as I know nothing. Maybe you should use some of that intelligence of yours and apply some reading comprehension. I never said you did not know anything. I specifically called out your comments on this particular subject, how they apply to military families serving abroad, and the children born into those families. This is what one constitutional law scholar believes: "Despite widespread popular belief, U.S. military installations abroad and U.S. diplomatic or consular facilities are not part of the United States within the meaning of the 14th Amendment. A child born on the premises of such a facility is not subject to the jurisdiction of the United States and does not acquire U.S. citizenship by reason of birth." The issue at hand is if McCain is a "Natural Born Citizen" since he was born in Panama. This question was raised time and again in my Con Law classes. Every time the class would split 50/50. "No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President -- The Constitution of the United States, Article II Section 1" It will be interesting to see if the courts will challenge the meaning of natural born citizen if McCain is elected. Many in Congress want to clarify it now rather than after he is elected. I am sure that scholar is more knowledgeable than I am, as well as you and your peers; however, maybe someone should have taken time to read the United States Naturalization Act of January 29, 1795. Combine it with the wording contained in the 14th Amendment of The Constitution of the United States of America and you have a very clear meaning of what our founders intended the term 'Naturalized Citizen' to mean. As I pointed out earlier, children born overseas to two American parents is automatically an American Citizen, as long as one parent had a residence in the U.S. prior to the birth of the child. The implication of what you are suggesting, that children born to U.S. service men and women serving abroad are not 'naturalized' citizens of the United States, has a very far reaching scope and have a profound affect on this country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fireman31 Posted June 28, 2008 Report Share Posted June 28, 2008 no one will believe it unless they want to believe. alot of people tend to put shades over there eyes when this subject comes up because they're afraid of the truth. and people these days tend to be REALLY biased about shit too. unless its right in front of there face, they don't believe it. just because they havn't done the research on it, they think it can't be true. theres some stupied ass people out there these days and it pisses me off. i came to the realization that society has made them like that. I hear ya, the thing that really bites my azz is that society as a whole generally turns the other cheek, but when sh*t hits the fan (like the economy is now) everyone b*tches and moans, but no one is willing to take a stand to stop this crap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black2003SS Posted June 28, 2008 Report Share Posted June 28, 2008 This is country is headed for a world of hurt if something doesnt change. And Obama doesn't represent change, its just good rhetoric to get elected, but he won't change a damn thing. Also, I don't think McCain will either. With Isreal threatening Iran, I'm not sure I want either one of them in office. Obama would run with his tail between his legs while gas goes to $10/gallon in a war with Iran. Yet, McCain would drag us into WWIII and gas would still be $10/gallon, or more. Neither one really has good economic policies. The funny thing is that 95% of the people in this country have about a 5yr olds comprehension of the politics in this country, seriously. More people tune into Brittney Spears and Paris Hilton gossip news than political debates, rallies, speeches, CNN, FOX news, etc. It's really quite sad. Those Dave Letterman, Jay Leno talk show type surveys are not far off when they ask people who the president is or if they know the opening line from the declaration of independence and less than like 30% know the answer. Also, not many people know that the framers of the constitution never fully intended to let the general population decide and election. That is basically why we have the electoral system and the loop hole that Bush won with in 2000 two centuries later. The framers did not believe the common citizen to be educated enough to make an informed decision on whom to elect, yet they felt that average citizen should have a say. By the way, an average citizen that could vote, was a white male property/land owner only. I suggest you guys look up and at least read the summaries of the federalist papers so you can argue more effectively about why politics is the way it is and where this country needs to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SS Silv Posted June 28, 2008 Report Share Posted June 28, 2008 This is country is headed for a world of hurt if something doesnt change. And Obama doesn't represent change, its just good rhetoric to get elected, but he won't change a damn thing. Also, I don't think McCain will either. With Isreal threatening Iran, I'm not sure I want either one of them in office. Obama would run with his tail between his legs while gas goes to $10/gallon in a war with Iran. Yet, McCain would drag us into WWIII and gas would still be $10/gallon, or more. Neither one really has good economic policies. The funny thing is that 95% of the people in this country have about a 5yr olds comprehension of the politics in this country, seriously. More people tune into Brittney Spears and Paris Hilton gossip news than political debates, rallies, speeches, CNN, FOX news, etc. It's really quite sad. Those Dave Letterman, Jay Leno talk show type surveys are not far off when they ask people who the president is or if they know the opening line from the declaration of independence and less than like 30% know the answer. Also, not many people know that the framers of the constitution never fully intended to let the general population decide and election. That is basically why we have the electoral system and the loop hole that Bush won with in 2000 two centuries later. The framers did not believe the common citizen to be educated enough to make an informed decision on whom to elect, yet they felt that average citizen should have a say. By the way, an average citizen that could vote, was a white male property/land owner only. I suggest you guys look up and at least read the summaries of the federalist papers so you can argue more effectively about why politics is the way it is and where this country needs to go. 95% huh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black2003SS Posted June 28, 2008 Report Share Posted June 28, 2008 (edited) Yes 95%. 95% of the people in this country support a candidate they know absolutely nothing about except for which their friends, news, or family have had influence in their decision over. There's no shame in it, it doesn't mean 95% of people are stupid, a good majority of them have very fulfilling careers and succesful lives. But that does not mean they know politics or are intimate with their candidates policies. A good analogy would be to say that 95% of the people in this country don't know how to perform heart surger or practice law, but doesn't mean they are stupid, just the average person trying to figure out how to do open heart surgery would be like a 5yr old trying to figure out how to drive a car. 95% of the public on average DO NOT research the candidates themselves. When was the last time anyone here truly independently sought out McCains or Obama's voting record (which is public record of course) and truly read the actual legislation for themselves? I would bet less than 5% have actually done that. People also fall for the fallacies, rhetoric, and propaganda portrayed in the news papers and on the news channels they watch (which are not necessarily liberal). Anyone who says the news is liberal, I have one word for you...Clinton. The news isnt liberal or biased. They project stories based on manufactured outrage or shock value, hence the over the top coverage of the Monica Lewinsky scandal. I am willing to also bet that less than 20% of the people on this board have read a good majority of the federalist papers, or writings from political theorists and investigated Locke, Jefferson Democratic Theory, Manifest Destiny, Nation Building Theories, and what American Exceptionalism is. Without all that knowledge, how can you honestly say you are making an informed decision? I love it when someone says "I'm voting for McCain because he will lower taxes..." Oh really? Do you know what his tax plan actually entails? And how do you propose to pay for the deficit it creates? On the flip side, someone would say "I'm voting for Obama because he is going to give us nation wide health care coverage..." Oh really? He might, but have you read how he plans to pay for it? Have you seen what the plan actually entails and how it will affect the medical industry or possibly affect the quality of care? Where do you think all of this government assistance will come from? Who's going to pay for it? Politics is full of straw man inductive fallacies and the country swallows them hook, line, and sinker. And if anyone wants to see where the US is headed? Come visit the "City of the Future" right up the road from me, Flint, Michigan. Back in the 60's and 70's, it was touted as the city of the future. Come have a visit and see where it is today and how it got to where it is. Where the United States is Economic wise today, is where Flint was 15 years ago. Its a small taste of what's to come. Flint went through a housing bubble, government corruption scandal after scandal, high unemployment rates, and increases in violence. Yes Michigan is hard hit, and some areas of the country will fair better than others, but most will suffer overall the same. The elitists in this country have the upper hand and nothing will happen until the elitists feel the pain at the pump, lose their millions, and see the ship sinking. And its not just the US. Remember all of those phone operator, tech support, IT, manufacturing, and other jobs we have lost to India in the last 15 years? Guess what? India's economy has gone through an economic boom not unlike ours of the later half of the 20th century. And now, labor is deemed to expensive over there. Now, India is starting to see some of those jobs leave their country as well in seek of cheaper labor (typically smaller more stable countries in africa and even some parts of Asia now). We won't see true reform until people take politics as serisouly as they take, for example, modding their trucks, or planning the ultimate party. Honestly, it will take $7-8/gallon at the pump and an unemployment rate of 10+% to make this country realize the leaders we have allowed to fleece America (Democrats and Republicans alike) were bad choices and finally force America as a whole to take action. It took the colonies decades to finally rise up with revolution to end the governing without representation and create a fair and equal republic. I pray to God that it doesn't take that long for Americans to realize the true damage we have allowed to happen to our own country and reverse its course. Edited June 28, 2008 by Black2003SS (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SS Silv Posted June 28, 2008 Report Share Posted June 28, 2008 (edited) my attention span is too short to read the novel you just wrote. damn ADD. just jokin' around man. Edited June 28, 2008 by SS Silv (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSS04 Posted June 28, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2008 my attention span is too short to read the novel you just wrote. damn ADD. just jokin' around man. he's just very passionate about this subject, as should we all. its these kinds of things that concern our future and our childrens future in this great country, and the elite are taking that away from us. i agree with blackss03 about everything he said. the elite of the country make all the important decisions for us, even if the outcome if horrible for the country. just as long as it's positive towards they're business intrests, they can give two shits about the american people. that is what this country has boiled down too and it really pisses me off. change needs to come around soon or it will be too late before we know it. the reason why no one really see's this coming is because its in there plan to change the country for the worst gradually over time, not all at once. if it were all at once, then the people would definetly rebel. people need to get this into there minds and see the changes already taking place and put pieces of the puzzle together. the country is doomed if we the people don't act now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brobradh77 Posted June 28, 2008 Report Share Posted June 28, 2008 I agree about the elitist BS...I mean why do they or should they give a crap about....say gas prices??? when your a million/billioniare those prices dont affect them like it does us..so it gets shuffled down to the bottom of the TO DO list under caongresional raises etc.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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