What sounds better in our trucks?

[SS_bnoon_SS]

3/4" from what i remember.  i did not build it, i purchased it.  for the cost involved in "Trial by Error" i figured it would be cheaper to purchase it from the provided link.

 

so, ahh....alright then. i'm gonna go hop in my finished truck that has 2 L7's now.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

If I knew I wanted 12" L7's, I would have built them in there by raising the seat. The problem is, I have 6 sub setups to choose from that are left over from other systems. I have 3 JL Audio 8W6's, 2 10" McCauley DVC 1800 watt subs, a 12" Alpine type R, a 12" Solobaric (10 year old series 1), a 12" L7 (brand new closeout for 100 bucks), and 2 10" DVC Orion XTR's (that are also about 10 years old).

 

The wood I have is cheap when compared to the upholstery work that will be done and buying a prebuilt box that costs me 6 times what the wood costs me would not fit my needs. Especially one that doesn't have enough room to fit my feet on the floor when the front seats are all the way back. The 12" L7 will not fit in the room provided, and still fit those needs.

[Meegs]

you keep saying the L7's will not fit. I have posted pictures stating that YES indeed 2 s12L7's will fit WITHOUT raising the seat and NOT now haveing a tuck with a "booster" seat.

 

I only stated that YES indeed 2 L7's will fit perfectally without raising the seat. and i stand by that 100% the box is 3/4" MDF, sealed and was shipped to my door for less than what would have cost me to build it. taking into effect the price tag that goes for my time and wasted materials trying to make 2 L7's fit W/O raising the seat.

 

buy the box and reappulster with whatever matterial of you choosing....

 

 

:shake my head: Booster Seat WTF!

[Meegs]

. Especially one that doesn't have enough room to fit my feet on the floor when the front seats are all the way back. The 12" L7 will not fit in the room provided, and still fit those needs.

 

the box is recessed from the rear seat allowing you to fit anoter passengers feet comfortably with the drivers seat in the furthest setting.

 

it does fit, and fit fine. At this point i have no idea why you can not see that!

[DaJoker SS]

here are some pics....

 

Subthump Ultra deep box. down firing. don't worrie about the down fireing, i have more bass than ANY 17 yearold!!!!!!!

 

I dont know if you have more bass then me and im 17.

[SS_bnoon_SS]

. Especially one that doesn't have enough room to fit my feet on the floor when the front seats are all the way back. The 12" L7 will not fit in the room provided, and still fit those needs.

 

the box is recessed from the rear seat allowing you to fit anoter passengers feet comfortably with the drivers seat in the furthest setting.

 

it does fit, and fit fine. At this point i have no idea why you can not see that!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Mounted on a piece of 3/4" MDF (MINIMUM frontal clearance for this driver's X-max), the magnet comes into contact with the bottom of the seat, let alone having another piece of 3/4" as the back of the box, let alone giving proper clearance for the sound to escape past the rubber surround at X-max, let alone having any recommended clearance over the pole piece for proper cooling (which I will also need to keep the driver from blowing with 600-800 watts going through one driver).

 

The ONLY way to mount tihs driver in the PROPER fashion is to raise the seat, or to rotate the 12l7 forward, which would require taking up foot space! At this point i have no idea why you can not see that!

[haynss]

 

 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

i dont know how that box meegs has would fit that sub especially with 3/4 mdf.

if it does fit like meegs says, im sure the sub will be overheating soon or the SQ isnt as good as it could be.

[misterp]

i dont know how that box meegs has would fit that sub especially with 3/4 mdf.  if it does fit like meegs says, im sure the sub will be overheating soon or the SQ isnt as good as it could be.

With 2800-watts you could put those woofers in .5 cu.ft. @ and it would still sound good.

 

Mr. P.

[Meegs]

click on this immage and it will blow up so you can see it closer.

you will see that there is a lip that goes around the box. the "floor"(?) of the sub box is recessed AND the sub is not mounted as per your picture. it is mounted with the sub OVER the "floor"(?) of the sub box.

 

OK after that then if you look at the contour of our Trucks Floor you will notice a nice little "Hump" almost where a normal persons heals of there feet would rest. YOU can see this "Hump" in your photo and you will ALSO notice IN YOUR OWN PIC that after this hump there is air space after it. This is exhibited in your picture. that is valuable space that you are not utilizing.

 

I don't care dude.....i have 2 L7's that you say do not fit W/O raising the seat and i say that is a LIE.

 

do they over-heat, do they not have as much SQ? beats the hell out a me. i have been ussing this box with a BUNCH of watts pushing them and no problems thus far. Are they low in SQ? uhum, sound good to my ears.

I run 1 remote bass controll and can all but turn them totaly off, then turn a dial and then it is louder, tighter, crisper, louder, good enuf SQ, louder than anything i need.

 

 

hey man, 2 L7's fit W/O raising the seat.

 

PERIOD

 

I blew up my race car so i have much work ahead of me. I also have a few other cars that i need to finish.

 

as you can see i have too much work to finish to keep up this bitch-fest.

so, ahh....alright then.  i'm gonna go hop in my finished truck that has 2 L7's now.

Edited June 23, 2006 by Meegs (see edit history)

[fast4popper]

i dont know how that box meegs has would fit that sub especially with 3/4 mdf.  if it does fit like meegs says, im sure the sub will be overheating soon or the SQ isnt as good as it could be.

With 2800-watts you could put those woofers in .5 cu.ft. @ and it would still sound good.

 

Mr. P.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

what does wattage have to do with box sq? the box needs to be built right in order to sound good, please do explain, I am lost!

[misterp]

what does wattage have to do with box sq?  the box needs to be built right in order to sound good, please do explain, I am lost!

I was being half-sarcastic.

 

Understand that my boom-wagon days were 1989-1993; a ZAPCO amp was the shit back then. Anyways, power was the problem for us at the time, so to really get the boom (SPL) that we wanted a ported or ported-bandpass box was the only real option, because we could only afford 300-watts of amplification at the time. I built lots of ported boxes for several years, loved them and did well with them but in the early 90's a lot of popular music really went low, I mean REALLY low like 28-32hz was prominent in a lot of emerging music (think Too Short ). The problem I ran into with ported boxes is that the woofer goes *completely* unloaded below the tuning frequency of the port, basically the driver behaves like the walls of the box completely dissappear and the suspension is in free-air, and it cost the life of a couple woofer surrounds . So, in the quest for massive bass the ported box demonstrated its limit.

 

For another season I broke out the spreadsheet and whipped up a couple 1/4-wave folded-horn designs, very similar to the ones Orion had in their demo vans. Folded horns weigh a friggen ton in material (imagine dual 12's in a 1.5-ft x 2-ft x 4-ft 300+ lb enclosure) and that was just insane though the boxes made 116-db @ 1-watt. This definitely proved to be a home audio design. Freaking expensive to build, 1-2/3rds sheet of 3/4-MDF per box; at that price we were gong broke just leaving the homecenter store. Amazing sounding though, if you have never heard a folded horn before you're missing out. I want to build another pair sometime down the road for home...

 

In the end we resigned ourselves to making sealed boxes optimized for SPL at around 35-hz. So think of stuff like a 15" in a 2.25 cu-ft box, or a 12" in a 1.6 cu-ft box (booorrring).

 

Then an epihany - what we realized is that in a small sealed box the woofer has to work harder to compress the air inside the enclosure (duh!) in effect you are adding mechanical loading against the driver. You do loose a bit of subsonic response, but in a vehicle who cares and the trade-off is that you get MUCH more control of cone excursion, the cone is less likely to rip itself loose from its own surround at power. This was no secret at the time, professional installers know that "small boxes save woofers", but when class-D amps became available it was a godsend, we could really afford to reliably pour massive power through the woofer and finally get the SPL we wanted - safely.

 

It is no coincidence that new millenium woofers have huge motors (for high current) and Theile-Small optimized for use in small enclosures. For real slamming performance the recipie is a small-ish sealed box + some internal batting + as much power as you can afford, even to the point of over-driving as long as you do not clip. Normally the speaker would not give the deep low-end response that a 'properly sized' (larger) enclosure but it does allow one to safely take 1000-watts (assuming the motor will hold-up) and that is literally an entire order of magnitude more power (100W vs. 1000W); that alone will give you 3db more right off the bat (every 3db is a literal doubling in the perceived volume of sound). You are basically trading power for enclosure space.

 

It's late - sorry to ramble on...

 

Mr. P.

 

edit - it is SO important to avoid clipping at all costs I decided to say it here. If you are going to run massive power you have got to be certain that you DO NOT clip or you will smoke a woofer; it's very parallel to engine detonation while under boost, any little bit and you will damage something.

Edited June 23, 2006 by misterp (see edit history)

[StealthSS]

4 10s would sound killer also, w/ about 1000 watts run to them...

[SS_bnoon_SS]

i dont know how that box meegs has would fit that sub especially with 3/4 mdf.  if it does fit like meegs says, im sure the sub will be overheating soon or the SQ isnt as good as it could be.

With 2800-watts you could put those woofers in .5 cu.ft. @ and it would still sound good.

 

Mr. P.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

what does wattage have to do with box sq? the box needs to be built right in order to sound good, please do explain, I am lost!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Actually, wattage does play a part in SQ, especially in small boxes. The extra power gives the driver the control it needs to recreate sounds outside of the box's natural resonance frequencies, especially when bumping the signal on different frequency zones with an EQ to flatten the curve. It doesn't make the box SQ any different, but it does play a large part in overall SQ when using the signal and driver to correct box shortfalls.

 

Meegs, I'm sorry it went this far out of control. I can see that they do physically fit, even if only barely, and I hope that you enjoy them in your box. Just understand that they do not fit the way I want them to be in my truck for longevity or SQ sake, which is what I'm going for. As I said, my older 12" round Solo is 10 years old and still pounds with the best of them. With the older 12 in there, I have the room I want and still have the bass I was looking for. With a few box tweeks, I'll have the SQ I'm looking for too. Thanks for your discussion, and we'll agree to disagree on this one incident.

Edited June 23, 2006 by SS_bnoon_SS (see edit history)

[haynss]

i dont know how that box meegs has would fit that sub especially with 3/4 mdf.  if it does fit like meegs says, im sure the sub will be overheating soon or the SQ isnt as good as it could be.

With 2800-watts you could put those woofers in .5 cu.ft. @ and it would still sound good.

 

Mr. P.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

im sure the sub will be overheating soon or the SQ isnt as good as it could be.

sure you can do anything, but you know that always doesnt make it right.....just like mcgoofy, yeah its lowered but does it mean its right?

 

 

EDIT: i see i missed your sarcasim....i will need to work on that

I think this conversation all started with the assumption of things being done properly. Meegs is correct in saying it will fit and has shown that, SS_Boon is interested in the proper "space" for quality and longevity.

 

both valid but in the end just comes down to what you like

and i like my 2 10w7s pushed by 1400 watts @ 1.5ohms

Edited June 23, 2006 by haynss (see edit history)

[misterp]

Actually, wattage does play a part in SQ, especially in small boxes. The extra power gives the driver the control it needs to recreate sounds outside of the box's natural resonance frequencies, especially when bumping the signal on different frequency zones with an EQ to flatten the curve. It doesn't make the box SQ any different, but it does play a large part in overall SQ when using the signal and driver to correct box shortfalls.

 

Meegs, I'm sorry it went this far out of control. I can see that they do physically fit, even if only barely, and I hope that you enjoy them in your box. Just understand that they do not fit the way I want them to be in my truck for longevity or SQ sake, which is what I'm going for. As I said, my older 12" round Solo is 10 years old and still pounds with the best of them. With the older 12 in there, I have the room I want and still have the bass I was looking for. With a few box tweeks, I'll have the SQ I'm looking for too. Thanks for your discussion, and we'll agree to disagree on this one incident. 

I'm very interested to see what you come up with.

 

Mr. P.

[misterp]

4 10s would sound killer also, w/ about 1000 watts run to them...

Four 10" round woofers have the same effective cone area as two 12's; they "couple" to as much air as dual 12's. You are going to have a lot easier time packaging two 12's under the back seat than you are four 10's.

 

Mr. P.