Black2003SS Posted February 12, 2010 Report Share Posted February 12, 2010 My built trans had about 37k miles on it and the 3-4clutch pack went out on it (it had been slipping for about a 1k miles). I lost 3rd and 4th gears, but still had reverse, 1st, and 2nd. The shop was great in the fact that they agreed to cover some of the cost of repairs even though the 24k mile warranty had expired. They agreed to do a refresh for $1,000 including pulling the trans, R&R and replacing all friction components inside. When they first built the trans in 2008, it was great. 1-2 shift was firm and crisp, but not obnoxious. The 2-3 and 3-4 were also fine. The truck ran well, far better than the stock one. I do a lot of highway driving and towing with a boat so they think thats what might have caused the 3-4 clutches to burn up. They were toast, I was able to inspect them. The 2nd clutch pack was in great shape. No hard parts failed. Also, I sent the torque converter out to be cut and cleaned. When they installed the trans in 2008, one thing they stipulated was that they wanted the tune returned to stock pressures for the trans (basically stock settings). I called up zippy and told him what they put in the trans (transgo HD2, 2600 stall, blue clutch packs, superior servos, etc.) Zippy said no problem and he whipped up the file in short time and got it to me. Again, nothing wrong for 37k miles. Here is the problem. The truck has been down 3 weeks now (1.5 of that due to shipping the converter out and getting it back). The trans shop calls me yesterday and tells me they were having some issues with the blue clutch packs being too thin for the drum? So they said at no extra cost, they ordered Alto red clutch packs? The cost was a little more, but they werent charging me for it. Well, then I call them today and they tell me that they dont like the way the trans is shifting now. The builder said the pressures were too high and that they needed to pull the valve body and inspect it. They do, and then said they dont see nothing wrong with it. So then they asked me about the tuning, which I havent touched since I loaded up zippy's update in 2008. They want me to bring HPTuners over and try loading the file up again, but I dont think thats the problem. From a logical stand point, if the trans worked for 37k before with the tune that was in there, it should work fine now if there were no issues with the trans itself right? They said that they are seeing 200psi on the 1-2 shift when it should be near 90 (which I recall from my limited knowledge to somewhat correct). The builder said he had called transgo and they advised on some modification on the drum where he had to drill out a bleeder hole on the drum (open it up more) to help flow and prevent 4th clutch pack burnout. I'm clueless on that one, or if I'm even explaining it right, but thats what I took away from it. Truthfully, I was paying much attention because I have alot on my plate elsewhere right now. I just trusted these guys to get it fixed. I believe these guys want to make it right and not rip me off as they never have (last trans only cost $1,600 plus install). They have proven to stand behind their work even when they didnt have to. I have sent them business and they know it, and want me to keep sending them business. I'm just at a loss right now on what to do. I dont think reflashing the pcm is going to solve the problem, because the same pressures zippy programmed will still be there. Is it possible that the valve body is bad and they just dont realize it? Any constructive criticism would be appreciated with exception of ordering a Rossler or FLT because I just cant afford it right now. Maybe Danny, Mr. P, or even Zippy can provide some guidance. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detjoe Posted February 13, 2010 Report Share Posted February 13, 2010 sorry to hear about the issues. I hope you get it resolved, I know a local guy who is super cheap and does alot of local stuff, built my trans, if you end up needing a 2nd opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippy Posted February 13, 2010 Report Share Posted February 13, 2010 I don't quite understand the part of the blue plate clutches being too thin for the drum. The blue plate clutches certainly aren't thinner than the Alto Red's. The tune isn't going to change at all so their thought on that is just rediculous. If you had slippage going on the pcm would have altered line pressure though from the shift time being slow. The trans adapts would have caused the line pressure to come up. Hopefully they know and have the tools to reset that. They may want to inspect the pressure control solenoid or the pump first. Here are line pressure readings from the GM manal. Shift pressure and line pressure at the test port aren't the same thing. 4.8 L/5.3 L/6.0 L 0.00 (amps at the pressure control solenoid) 198-227 (psi line pressure) 0.10 197-226 0.20 189-221 0.30 181-216 0.40 168-205 0.50 154-193 0.60 137-175 0.70 114-156 0.80 90-132 0.90 64-105 1.00 53-85 This test must be preformed at 1200 RPM and between 100°F and 200°F. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malibutwins Posted February 13, 2010 Report Share Posted February 13, 2010 Plus you can adjust clutch clearance with the snap ring or the apply plates. Correct me if I'm wrong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detjoe Posted February 15, 2010 Report Share Posted February 15, 2010 bump, any word Doug?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black2003SS Posted February 15, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2010 Actually, yes. I just came from the trans shop and got into work. My laptop with windows XP took a dump so re-writing the tune or pulling codes was out. HP Tuners was on the laptop. I spent the weekend trying to get my laptop fixed to no avail. The hard drive is toast. Thank god I backed up my HPT files in email folder on my yahoo account. I was able to borrow my fiances fathers laptop with windows Vista. I installed HPT on it this morning, but am having issues with the drivers, which I have researched on the HPT forum and downloaded the correct drivers. I should have HPT working later tonight. The trans issue. I spoke with the master builder there. He said that they have eliminated the trans as the issue and say it must software related because they have a diagnostic tool called Trans X? He said that when they plug that into the trans, it replaces the vehicle pcm. The trans shifts fine with it. When they hook up my vehicle pcm, it throws trans codes (listed below) and the high pressures and hard shifts come back. So we are going to try to re-write the pcm first with zippy's tune. I looked over the tune file this morning and it looks good. Its basically stock parameters for the tune. Here are the codes the pcm is throwing: P0713 Trans Temp Circuit P0740 - Torque Converter Solenoid Clutch P0785 - 3-2 Shift Timing Solenoid P1860 - Torque Converter Clutch PWM Solenoid Circuit Being at work, I'm at a loss to research these right now. We did unplug the battery to try to reset the pcm and that did not work, so we will try to re-write the software onto it. If that doesn't work, I'll be at a loss myself. Also, when the codes are cleared out by their snap-on diagnostic tool (how we got the codes since HPT wasnt working yet), the codes come right back. Yet, when they hook up trans X, the codes dont come up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detjoe Posted February 15, 2010 Report Share Posted February 15, 2010 Lets say computer and trans check good. then what other issue might cause this? Possible crimped line? Clog in cooling? Just trying to throw out ideas so you can go in there and git it right! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black2003SS Posted February 15, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2010 (edited) Well thats the thing. The trans cooler and lines were flushed. They cleaned the pump, cleaned the valve body twice. Replaced and inspected everything. I even sent the converter out to yank to be cut and cleaned, which it was. I suppose that what will happen is either retuning the truck will solve it and if it doesn't, then it will throw it back on the shop to figure it out. This really sucks too because I have a buyer for the truck lined up, but I think he might be backing out with all of the issues I'm having getting it back on the road. I don't blame him at this point. However, the good news is that it is just a machine and there is a solution, just have to find what it is. I am leaning towards a possible install error myself or a short in the wiring if the tune doesnt fix it. Edited February 15, 2010 by Black2003SS (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chpspecial Posted February 15, 2010 Report Share Posted February 15, 2010 Actually, yes. I just came from the trans shop and got into work. My laptop with windows XP took a dump so re-writing the tune or pulling codes was out. HP Tuners was on the laptop. I spent the weekend trying to get my laptop fixed to no avail. The hard drive is toast. Thank god I backed up my HPT files in email folder on my yahoo account. I was able to borrow my fiances fathers laptop with windows Vista. I installed HPT on it this morning, but am having issues with the drivers, which I have researched on the HPT forum and downloaded the correct drivers. I should have HPT working later tonight. The trans issue. I spoke with the master builder there. He said that they have eliminated the trans as the issue and say it must software related because they have a diagnostic tool called Trans X? He said that when they plug that into the trans, it replaces the vehicle pcm. The trans shifts fine with it. When they hook up my vehicle pcm, it throws trans codes (listed below) and the high pressures and hard shifts come back. So we are going to try to re-write the pcm first with zippy's tune. I looked over the tune file this morning and it looks good. Its basically stock parameters for the tune. Here are the codes the pcm is throwing: P0713 Trans Temp Circuit P0740 - Torque Converter Solenoid Clutch P0785 - 3-2 Shift Timing Solenoid P1860 - Torque Converter Clutch PWM Solenoid Circuit Being at work, I'm at a loss to research these right now. We did unplug the battery to try to reset the pcm and that did not work, so we will try to re-write the software onto it. If that doesn't work, I'll be at a loss myself. Also, when the codes are cleared out by their snap-on diagnostic tool (how we got the codes since HPT wasnt working yet), the codes come right back. Yet, when they hook up trans X, the codes dont come up. My truck trew this code at me and it turned out to be two wires on the engine side of the round trans plug that where broken loose. the only fix for me was to replace the engine side of the trans plug wich involevd cutting and sodering a new harness which was a pain in the ass. by the look of the rest of your codes it looks like that might be the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippy Posted February 16, 2010 Report Share Posted February 16, 2010 With the codes you have being set you have found your reason for the hard shifts. Default for the trans is max line pressure. Maybe they should work on what's setting the codes rather than being concerned about the software that has worked fine. Unless you had some weird pcm failure or set a magnet on the pcm the code in the pcm doesn't change. The pcm 0 fuse should be looked at first, but here are some issue's from the codes. Max line pressure will be commanded. 2-3 shift will be commanded soft. 4 gear will not be allowed. TCC will not be allowed. Sounds to me like they fixed the trans and caused a problem with the harness when removing or re-installing the trans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black2003SS Posted February 16, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2010 Thank you guys for all of your help. Zippy hit the nail on the head as usual. The trans shop called last night and filled me in. While we were figuring it out over here, the master builder there (he doesnt do the installs, they have an installer only) had discovered a blown fuse that was causing the codes. He also discovered that the installer did in fact damage the connector and it was shorting out, causing the fuse to blow. They replaced connector free of charge. They are now able to dial the trans in and I should have the truck back tomorrow. I also was able to get HPT working and did reflash the pcm just for the heck of it, not that it made any difference. Sometimes I just panic and think that I might get taken advantage of, but these guys have really bent over backwards to make this thing work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippy Posted February 18, 2010 Report Share Posted February 18, 2010 Good to see they found it. Unfortunatly having been in this line of work for years I often see honest problems well over looked because a truck is modified. The tech will always blame the modification(s) when they should start over and actually diagnose it. Congrats on getting your truck back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
96vteccd5 Posted February 18, 2010 Report Share Posted February 18, 2010 Glad they got it figured out bro! Food for thought for me later whenever I get some trans work done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dcairns Posted March 6, 2010 Report Share Posted March 6, 2010 (edited) My built trans had about 37k miles on it and the 3-4clutch pack went out on it (it had been slipping for about a 1k miles). I lost 3rd and 4th gears, but still had reverse, 1st, and 2nd. Interesting, I had the exact same failure on my 03 SS, except I did not get much warning and I made it up to 78,898 miles. I have a Radix and tow our travel trailer occasionally. Edited March 6, 2010 by dcairns (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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